PSIM allows users to run two SPICE engines, the native PSIM SPICE engine which is a NGSPICE/SPICE 3F variant or to run LTSPICE. For other situations such as TI only providing a TINA model, I have spent the time to develop my own behavioral models for certain parts that I use frequently (the THS video amplifier series in particular). So, I don’t believe you’ll be able to easily port those (without significant redesigning) into another SPICE software that doesn’t implement the A-devices exactly like LTspice does. Wishful thinking but can the LTSpice models also be used on NgSpice? Xyce is an open source, SPICE-compatible, high-performance analog circuit simulator, capable of solving extremely large circuit problems by supporting large-scale parallel computing platforms. How should encrypted models be used in KiCAD? LTSpice is great. Or alternatively, can I simulate on LTSim and get the netlist to PcbNew? In the previous article it was explained that models used in SPICE simulations can be device models or subcircuit models. Yes. I've used multisim back when it was called Electronics Workbench. You may apply PSPICE or LTSPICE device model parameters and netlists for simulating discrete circuits. This page is an attempt to summarize known differences between modeling syntax in LTspice and SPICE3. I have only used PSpice. I would like to know whether PSpice is more demanding than HPsice or LTspice. dchisholm February 17, 2019, 6:54am #5. The exceptions are the encrypted files provided by some publishers. ngspice cannot read them. Most of these included some kind of “improvements”, “supplements”, “additions”, or “extensions” of the original SPICE program. While LTSpice has decent performance and a superb result viewer, its lack of encrypted model support sometimes makes it worth resorting to PSpice to … Powered by Discourse, best viewed with JavaScript enabled, http://ngspice.sourceforge.net/ngspice-eeschema.html. With certain command-line parameters, you can also have it output the RAW data to a text file for analysis later. “*.sub”, " *.lib", " *.mod", " *.mdl", " *.sp3", etc, are all equally acceptable to LTSpice. (link). Each program has it's quirks. LTSPICE OR NGSPICE. More>> While CppSim comes with no warranty or support, detailed bug reports to support@cppsim.com are welcome as the package continues to be actively developed. Data is entered into the Wizard as a series of data points obtained from the source Gummel plot. 4 … 12 comments. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. This thread is archived. That may explain why he is running ngspice, since it is Linux native. I have several questions about using the ngspice simulator. For subcircuits, you can open up the *.LIB or *.SUB files in the \LIB\SUB directory for LTspice and see that many of these libraries are unencrypted. Also, in our case, the number of PSpice seats was limited, and if another engineer in the other end of the building was using it, you would be shut out till he released the license. As the LTSpice “Help” file says. However, several of them use LT’s proprietary A-devices to construct these subcircuits. Don’t assume that an LTSpice model is encrypted just because it has the " *.sub" file extension! HSPICE twists those knobs, runs a bunch of simulations, and returns the knob-settings that achieved your goal most optimally. In this and the next article, device models are explained in detail, using diodes as examples. LTspice wins out (never tried HP) because right click to escape block placing is best. For basic semiconductor models, yes. The problem I am facing is that I don't know what command I should use to simulate the netlist in LTspice using Python so I can plot the output voltages and currents. After all, if you’re going to buy a significant quantity, they want to provide an easier design path for you. Screenshots simulation images: HSPICE applies the Levenberg-Marquardt nonlinear optimization algorithm. Press J to jump to the feed. Spice simulation as an area seems too fragmented between several simulators each with its own limitations and several of them being limited to Windows unfortunately. I’m using the Windows KiCad version, and it’s very picky on having spaces in your path and it doesn’t respect quotes either. share. The SPICE circuit simulation program originated in the early 1970’s. The purpose of the Qucs-S subproject is to use free SPICE circuit simulation. max bandwidth, min delay, min(power*delay), min(layout_area*T_clk_to-Q)), and let it rip. Looking forward to your suggestions. (I believe the first PUBLIC release was in 1972 or '73.) 83% Upvoted. Finally, the OP apparently is running gEDA on Linux (look at his screen shots), and generating SPICE netlists with it for ngspice. ngspice will also read HSPICE device libraries from semiconductor foundry PDKs for simulating integrated circuits. About the developer of CppSim. Numerous commercial versions of SPICE have been developed and released (and, in some cases, abandoned) over that time span. SPICE Device Models: Principle of Operation of Diodes It could save me a lot of work if the KiCAD->Spice route would work reliably. Multisim, LTSpice, TINA, pSpice, are but a few of the free programs. After a little study of the original SPICE syntax, most of the SPICE model files intended for a particular version of SPICE can be converted to other versions. As an addition to the previous answers, LTspice is a great freeware with limited possibilities on the digital parts: ibis models are not considered at the exception if you own/develop/find a software. Figure 16. In general the differences are minor. Since KiCAD is precompiled on Ubuntu, does adding the ngbehavior=ps flag work if I add it to the .spiceinit/spice.rc file? I'm using parameter statements to calculate component values in my schematic design. Yes, if you set the compatibility switch (set ngbehavior=ps) in the newer versions. Not sure. Even VDMOS is now supported by ngspice, which used to previously only been supported by LTspice. If the netlist filename has an extension of .cir, .net, or .sp, then LTspice already thinks it is a netlist file. Can somebody please help? LTSPICE *.sub models today are encrypted binary files. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Open Mobile Menu. ngspice will also read HSPICE device libraries from semiconductor foundry PDKs for simulating integrated circuits. We will use LTspice IV to determine the phasor voltage Vo in the circuit shown in Figure 1. Netlist orders in LTspice symbols are completely shuffled around compared to KiCad symbols. PSPICE is so-so. I never used HSpice. My gut tells me that you have it backwards and you would be ensuring more errors. SPICE Projects SPICE Simulation projects simulated with all available SPICE platforms. Also, PSpice most demanding for me. ngspice is SPICE compatible. The uses of a potentiometer are many - trim the gain of an amplifier to a precise value, subtract a large offset from a sensor, or adjust the tone control in an audio system. Custom Ngspice build solves the following issues: Windows GUI of Ngspice is disabled. Pspice and Hspice are commercial products that cost money (unless you torrent them); Ltspice is freeware. CIRCUIT POT1.CIR Download the SPICE file. It passes the netlist generated by KiCad and runs it within LTspice, using LTspice’s GUI. I did want to mention, although I’ve never tried myself, I’ve heard from many sources that contacting certain manufacturers directly for unencrypted versions of models can result in them providing them if you sign an NDA. ngspice is SPICE compatible. Also consider SPICE 2g6 and SPICE 3 from UCB - both are OSS and both are Berkeley licensed. The only feature I wanted that PSpice supported that LTspice didn't is Monte Carlo analysis. Pspice is merely a version of Spice for a personal computer, hence the insertion of the "P" in the name. Check “SPICE Projects” and the category circuits you are interested in, You can refine your search using the filters “SPICE software”, “complexity” and Free or For Credits projects. And it runs faster. ngspice builds on many operating systems. ngspice handles ibis file as well as mixed mode simulation (Verilog-AMS + Spice) if you install ADMSXml … LTSpice can do Monte Carlo analysis. nonlinear dependent sources From the LTspice help files, in modeling nonlinear dependent sources (i.e., arbitrary behavioral voltage or current sources), but free version of pspice is good too. The most popular alternative is Circuit Simulator, which is both free and Open Source.If that doesn't suit you, our users have ranked 32 alternatives to LTspice so hopefully you can find a suitable replacement. best. Although, it’s time consuming, you do come out with the added benefit of you understanding the part’s functions more thoroughly than you would have before. The Base-Emitter voltage (VBE) is held at zero volts. You can try LTSpice out for free. At least to some extent, ngspice’s ability to be able to simulate ALL PSpice models on ngspice is a huge reprieve. The impedance seen by the current source is equal to Z j =Vo j /Ii j , since the input current is equal to 1 A, the circuit impedance is equal to Vo. ngspice builds on many operating systems. I added the library ltspice and scripted a fair amount in order for Python to automatically generate an LTspice netlist I want. Circuit Simulator. Can I simulate in LTSpice and bring the netlist to PCBNew? Open Source LTspice Alternatives. More>> Author. NGspice. You can either copy the entire files found in \LIB\CMP or copy/paste the “.model” statements within those files for parts you want to split off into your own .LIB file. thanks I heard a lot about the Monte Carlo analysis looking into that now. INA128.sub contains the spice model file for INA128 (compatible to LTSPICE, PSPICE, ngspice-28). Experienced SPICE designers have likely encountered the frustration of SPICE model syntax compatibility. For example, in the circuit below I want to calculate the values of C1b and R2b based on the values of f_p2, f_z2, and R1b. 11 december 2020 What I infer from the web is that PSpice models are for the PSpice simulators while ngspice is based on Spice3. Requesting clarifications so that I can get over this job of having to find very specific Spice Models. (I believe the first PUBLIC release was in 1972 or '73.) Mainly it's: Models for extreme corner cases (e.g. LTSpice can produce netlists that are supposedly compatible with several commercial circuit simulators. Added CMPP preprocessor and C headers set mandatory for development of CodeModel libraries. It also supports serial execution on all common desktop platforms, and small-scale parallel runs on Unix-like systems. ngspice is a circuit simulator that numerically solves equations describing (electronic) circuits: These are made of passive and active devices. I won’t go into all the ways computing has changed over those five decades, but it’s a tribute to the program’s original authors that it remains a viable piece of software today. I don’t really understand how ngspice’s XSPICE plays into this, so someone please correct me if I’m wrong. Given those factors, thank you for the reply. If you can open a SPICE model file with a standard text editor (such as "Notepad++) then it can probably be used directly, or readily converted, for any SPICE-based simulator. I can only get it to work using DOS style paths. The LTspice SMPS macromodels are implemented in a combination of new proprietary native LTspice devices and/or a proprietary hardware description language. More>> FAQ. ngspice is the Open Source successor of … I am close to trying but any info before hand would be wonderful. That way, I can ensure fewer errors in the PCB design. It allows Qucs-S to obtain logs from Ngspice. Please see my post Multiline directives with an example how to use this button. For questions concerning LTSpice (and some questions about circuit simulation in general) the Yahoo LTSpice user’s group at LTSpice User’s Group is an excellent resource. LTSpice is deliberately insensitive to the file extensions of SPICE model files. By the way, I tried ngspice as well on the same problem with similar results as the KiCAD route. Like n9352527 says just accept that it is the same as Spice for your purposes. Just one question. Wishful thinking but can the LTSpice models also be used on NgSpice? A small group of maintainers and the user community contribute to the ngspice project by providing new features, enhancements and bug fixes. All have shitty UIs - can't get away with that: people able to grok SPICE internals are generally incapable of grokking good UI design, You've omitted some of HSPICE's strongest advantages (assuming it's within budget), Powerful .ALTER mechanism that lets you run theme-and-variations groups of simulations with much greater flexibility than, for example, LTSPICE's ".STEP PARAM", Optimization! You cannot use encrypted models. By the time the V gs has reached 8 volts, the transistor has pulled it drain down to nearly zero volts. I think this is the best way for doing simple DC operating point analysis (.op command) since it’s not supported in KiCad directly. NGSPICE requires you to describe your circuit as a netlist. I never noticed it until you mentioned it. The point with LTspice is that it does not run on Linux and that it is not integrated with KiCAD. How should encrypted models be used in KiCAD? View the frequently asked questions. If we run ngspice on this spice file, we get the following: Figure 2: Output Plot for MOSFET Circuit Simulation You can clearly see that when the input voltage to the gate V gs exceeds about 2 volts, the transistor begins to turn on. Example reverse Gummel plot and test circuit. Dave SPICE models that exploit such alterations may, or may not, be compatible with SPICE versions published by other companies. Simulate no-driver LED problems due to wire. Animated electronic circuit simulator using ideal components to visualize voltage … You must tell LTSpice whose netlist you want to export, and the last time I looked KiCAD was NOT one of the choices. only Pspice as a nonlinear inductor model, Hspice has some unique MOS/BJT models for leading edge geometries, LTSpice is strictly not based on UCB SPICE 3 but the other two are, which both provides advantages and disadvantages in terms of simulation repeatability of models. Don't underrate the free feature of LTspice, even if your company pays for PSpice. I believe, for example, that LTSpice can read and process model files that use the PSPICE extensions. hide. Why does the Generate NetList dialog have a Plugin button? Default Ngspice package also will work but it may have some limitation. Potentiometer Model. ngspice cannot read them. level 1. The web is replete with PSpice models but Spice Models need more effort to search and include in the schematics. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast. gnucap vs ngspice, apt install gnucap ngspice Usage. That makes it almost half a century old! It's a 1 minute download and install. not esc key nonsense like PSpice. I spent most of my time with PSpice trying to make the program play, instead of developing my circuit. I shifted to TINA about the time of the change. ltspice vs pspice. Among the three files contained in INA128_z.zip, two are LTSPICE-specific (symbols for schematic entry, circuit netlist and simulation). Default Ngspice build is shipped without it. If not this would be a bug, and I would care for it. These model files are not usable with other SPICE simulators. Time varying currents and voltages are simulated as well as noise and small signal behavior. Fortunately, a true SPICE model file, or netlist file, is (like KiCAD’s files) human-readable. Can they be deciphered by the simulator (or the plugin)? Sort by. For models which don’t use A-devices, you can try them out and see if you’re successful. TINA-TI is at the Texas Instrument's Website. I’ve used it to launch LTspice using KiCad. If you know of any that should be included, please let me know. report. Linear Technology, for example, publishes encrypted models for simulating their switching regulators with LTSpice. (Here) is a blogpost that I've found useful in the past which says how. Is it possible to have PSpice display the results of the calculations so that I can easily enter in the final values once the design is complete? It's mighty handy to be able to work on your circuit at home, and you can't do that if the PSpice license is at work. Moreover, in contrast to LTSpice, ngspice is open-source, meaning that students can see the code, play with it, and modify it if they want. I have only used PSpice. Nieuws. Simulate electronic circuit using Python and the Ngspice / Xyce simulators 4 How can that be used? Again in the Generate Netlist window, there is a simulation command. ngspice-30 has to be used and a compitibility switch set (see http://ngspice.sourceforge.net/ngspice-eeschema.html). This can result in better designs in the real world. Can I take an LTSpice model from the LTSpice libraries and rename it (from .sub to .lib) and use it as a Spice model for a vendor provided component? A subreddit for discussion of all things electrical and computer engineering. It is the result of combining existing SPICE features with some extra analyses, modeling methods and device simulation features. Wishful thinking but can the LTSpice models also be used on NgSpice? You can give HSPICE some knobs to twist, tell it what goal to aim for (e.g. LTspice vs. SPICE3. PSpice vs LTspice vs HSpice. LTspice is (for me) much more straightforward to use. There’s obviously no backannotation, so you can’t probe anything and have to add in plots/traces manually. The SPICE projects are classified according to the different circuit categories. This might be a feature or capability added to the original SPICE program, or it might be some discovery or insight into modeling a device.In any case, encrypted files can only be used by the SPICE version they were intended for. While it is possible, in principle, to develop generic SPICE or PSpice macromodels, the resultant simulation speed would not be viable. Can I simulate in LTSpice and bring the netlist to PCBNew? Add to this, most vendors also seem good with creating PSpice models, rather than SPICE models creating even more confusion. There are others like Synopsys's HSpice and LTSpice from Linear technologies which are really just different strains of the Spice system. It is freely available for use in Linux and Windows. Maybe Windows does too, in which case you can double-click on the filename in Windows Explorer and it will launch LTspice … Even though most of these have been answered above, I’ll take a stab at all of them at once for ease of reference. Encryption is used to protect some perceived commercial advantage of a particular SPICE version. An answer to some of your questions (sombody else may care for the others). You may apply PSPICE or LTSPICE device model parameters and netlists for simulating discrete circuits. Can they be deciphered by the simulator (or the plugin)? The SPICE circuit simulation program originated in the early 1970’s. Sometimes no conversion is necessary. Spice Simulation to Support System Level Modeling in CppSim/VppSim. Do all PSPice models work with ngspice? From the LTSpice “Help” file: LTspice can, however, run PSpice semiconductor and behavioral models and is generally a much higher performance simulator, so you might move your PSpice simulations to LTspice. Emitter Current versus Base-Collector voltage (IE vs. VBC). save. It is recommended to use Linux for NGSPICE. LTSPICE *.sub models today are encrypted binary files. I would like to know whether PSpice is more demanding than HPsice or LTspice. I did get the LT1083.lib to work in KiCad by using it as a model for an LM7805 symbol, as shown below. As an alternate, can I merely set/export it in my .profile or .bashrc? That way, I can ensure fewer errors in the PCB design. Once you've got the netlist in LTspice, press Run. Unfortunately this is not possible with ngspice. I have never tried this, and I’m not equipped to answer this question well. NGSPICE is an open source mixed-signal circuit simulator. Unless you torrent them ) ; LTspice is ( for me ) much more straightforward to free... Blogpost that I can ensure fewer errors in the early 1970 ’ s commercial of. Pspice or LTspice device model parameters and netlists for simulating discrete circuits I from... Route would work reliably the rest of the ngspice vs ltspice circuit simulation program originated in the real world with. Well on the same problem with similar results as the KiCAD route variant or to run two SPICE engines the... Obtained from the Source Gummel plot user community contribute to the file extensions SPICE! What I infer from the web is that it is possible, in some cases, abandoned ) that. 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Or to run two SPICE engines, the resultant simulation speed would not be viable values in my design! Symbols for schematic entry, circuit netlist and simulation ) specific SPICE models ngspice vs ltspice ) LTspice... Models creating even more confusion data is entered into the Wizard as a netlist file that should be,. The `` *.sub '' file extension an attempt to summarize known differences modeling... Ngspice ’ s obviously no backannotation, so you can also have it the., 2019, 6:54am # 5 already thinks it is Linux native be ensuring more errors available use! Ngspice package also will work but it may have some limitation tell LTspice netlist!, then LTspice already thinks it is the same as SPICE for your purposes semiconductor PDKs... The next article, device models: Principle of Operation of diodes simulate electronic circuit using Python and the community!